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By: sooz
Date: 4/12/99 8:19:55 AM
# Replies: 27
I'd like to begin this post with a disclaimer - I don't know diddly compared to you folks when it comes to high-tech banter. I generally scroll through such posts, hoping something might absorb into my head, and nodding at the rest.
Therefore, I'd like to pose what is probably a really dumb question.
I spent the $119 or whatever it was with Internic to register a domain name - www.richiel.com. Now, for TexNet (my service provider here in Austin) to tell the 'Net that richiel.com = http://lonestar.texas.net/~sooz/richiel.htm, they want $149 "set-up" and $100/month. That seems extreme to me, because I seem to recall seeing services that'll do this for $10/month.
I don't want to shuffle all my files to another ISP; if I'm thinking right, that would involve changing all the HTML on every blinkin' section of the page that currently has the http://lonestar.texas.net/~sooz in it. Yuck. I'm quite happy with TexNet's service for my needs - they're always up and I've never had a billing problem - I just don't wanna pay 'em $100/month to do this one thing, and I don't want to move my files from there, because they offer me 50 meg, which is huge, IMHO.
Any ideas?
Response #1
By: Homer The Brave
Date: 4/12/99 8:43:02 PM
Check out pair.com. 20megs of space on the FTP account is $5/month, $5 setup, and then they'll host your domain for a buck extra per month, with a $25 setup fee. You could link back to texas.net to serve your realaudio, too.
Response #2
By: Capt. Spastic
Date: 4/15/99 8:47:39 AM
Sooz, you guys don't have cable modems yet in your area?
Response #3
By: sooz
Date: 4/15/99 7:35:54 PM
I don't even know what one is, and I know I don't want to pay much.
Response #4
By: Capt. Spastic
Date: 4/16/99 3:23:49 PM
What area are you guys in?
Cable modems are available almost all over town up here now. Actually, for what you get, works out about the same as a tradtional ISP. And the througput kicks ass. You could, if you wanted, even store some of your files and stuff on your local system, and make a link to it from your WEB page. Would probably work well for ya.
Response #5
By: Ralf
Date: 4/16/99 3:28:57 PM
But I think you are required to run either a porn site or a Quake server... read your signup agreement carefully.
Response #6
By: sooz
Date: 4/16/99 9:17:07 PM
I'm in deep south Austin... honestly, though, I have no desire to go through what Fang's going through, or what anyone else with a cable modem is going through. I can't afford it, I don't want to deal with it, etc. etc.
I just want www.richiel.com to go to my web site.
This doesn't seem that hard.
Response #7
By: The Sorcerer
Date: 4/16/99 9:49:19 PM
How about a QUAKER server?
Response #8
By: Capt. Spastic
Date: 4/17/99 8:38:10 PM
Ralf: "But I think you are required to run either a porn site or a Quake server... read your signup agreement carefully. "
Either way, I've got it covered!!
sooz: "I'm in deep south Austin... honestly, though, I have no desire to go through what Fang's going through, or what anyone else with a cable modem is going through. I can't afford it, I don't want to deal with it, etc. etc. "
Well, I don't think, and I could be wrong (hey, it's happened), but I don't believe Fang is on a cable modem. They are just now as we speak moving the cable modems into the Houston area, we've had them here in Austin for about 8 months. I was on the early bird team, and I have to say, that I have been VERY happy with mine, and had VERY little problems. Which surprised even me, seeings it's Warner Cable. As far as afforadablity, when you add up what you are paying now for an ISP, plus most likely a 2nd phone line, it comes out about the same, and in some ways cheaper. You're talking approx. $20 a month for any halfway decent ISP, and about that for an addtional phone line. Now when you add in the slow xfer rates through a phone line, drops and disconnects through a traditional ISP, the $37 that Warner is getting for their service, with 5 e-mail accounts, is reall decent. You have a constant conenction, and a WRITTEN garuntee that the xfer rates will NEVER drop below what a 128k ISDN line delivers. You'll neve hear me singing Warners paises, when they have done something right, you have to give them credit. And here, they have. Cna't tell you how nice it is, hitting 2-300 kbps xfer rates, sending things from work!! :) Very nice indeed!! If you like some more info on it, go to whatis.com they have some great and comparions there on cable modems, as well as the ADSL that coming into Houston soon too. (You couldn't give me that crap though) If you have any specific questions about how you could get that tyo work locally for you sooz, e-mail me and I can explain it more to you.
Response #9
By: sooz
Date: 4/18/99 2:58:36 PM
Most of this is very far over my head.
I have unlimited service, and I also use this phone line for faxes. I'm really very happy with what I have. I pay $19/month and have a great time.
I just want www.richiel.com to go to http://lonestar.texas.net/~sooz/richiel.htm.
Is this THAT big a deal?
Response #10
By: The Sorcerer
Date: 4/18/99 8:24:22 PM
Sooz Says:
=================================
I have unlimited service, and I also use this phone line for faxes. I'm really very happy with what I have. I pay
$19/month and have a great time.
I just want www.richiel.com to go to http://lonestar.texas.net/~sooz/richiel.htm.
Is this THAT big a deal?
=================================
Well it SHOULDN'T be a bit deal, and it SHOULDN'T be as expensive as they price your provider quoted you, but you're kinda stuck if you want keep your existing service, web storage location and not recode your HTML.
Another option would be to get an account, webspace, and domain registered at a cheaper ISP, and just have your front page located there with a link pointing to your lonestar.texas.net pages. But then you've got the expense of the extra ISP and all. Check prices, when compared to the outrageous price lonestar wants just to give you a registered domain you might actually find a 2nd ISP & domain setup that is cheaper than to lonestar fee.
Cablemodems, ISDN, ADSL.... They are all really fantastic for us geeks, but from what you've said about your Internet needs I can't really see that it would be cost effective or worth you time and trouble to mess with right now. It would just be throwing more technology at something to address a really basic need. Ya' know?
Sorc'(Rev)
Response #11
By: The Sorcerer
Date: 4/18/99 8:40:32 PM
Spaz Sez:
========================
Well, I don't think, and I could be wrong (hey, it's happened), but I don't believe Fang is on a cable modem. They are just now as we speak moving the cable modems into the Houston area, we've had them here in Austin for about 8 months.
========================
Maybe just counting Warner cable. But Actually, people have had cablemodem access in Houston for over two years if they were lucky enough to be live in the right area and in an apartment complex fed by PhonoScope Cable. One of my techs last year specifically moved to a complex where she could get cablemodem access.
From what Fang has said, it sound like he's got a very sweet deal. 10baseT Ethernet jacks right in his apartment running to a hub or switch closet and then out some sort of leased line used to feed the whole complex. Hey Fang! You know what kind of link your complex has to the rest of the world?
Spaz Sez:
=============================
well as the ADSL that coming into Houston soon too. (You couldn't give me that crap though) If you have any
=============================
So why don't you like ADSL?
Sorc'(Rev)
Response #12
By: Capt. Spastic
Date: 4/18/99 9:45:24 PM
Sorc: "So why don't you like ADSL?"
Not that I don't really like it, it's just that from what I have seen amomgst many of my friends, they are letting their hatred of Wanrner cable, mar their judgement. For one thing, ADSL come is 2 flavors, lite and heavy. The lite version, is the pretty much the same as cable modem, 512 kbps. The heavy version is capable 6 Mbps, but they are charging an arm and a leg for it. (about as much as a T-1 last time I priced them back in August). From much of what I have read, they are very prone to congestions and burst problems, due to the way the POTS are set up typically. Also too, they are very prone to line drop off, the farther you are awat from the switching station, the worse your performance is. Price, perfomance, just not as comparable as what you get with the cable modem.
And I disagree with what you said to sooz. I think it would still to her benfit to get the cable modem. She could bring alot of her stuff to her home system, and not have to worry about anyone hosting anything for her. That's what I do here now. Feel free to hit ftp.captspastic.dynip.com anytime you like. Just to see what's there. Full download access on d: and e: There are MP3's in the MP3 and install directories. Also some Star Wars trailers. Feel free for you guys to grab anything you want, but please don't pass it around. That happened last year, and I had to shut down my FTP server for a month.
Response #13
By: Ralf
Date: 4/18/99 11:22:52 PM
Yep, that's absurdly cheap compared to what it would cost in Atlanta. *IF* it was even available, which it is not. Yet.
And cable modems can do much better than 512 Kbps... if nobody else is on your segment, you'll have around 6 Mbps available. It'll be a few years at least before the great mooing unwashed masses are willing to pay for high-speed access (most are still blown away by hearing "You Have Mail") and until then, most cablemodemers WILL have bountiful thruput.
Me? I'm delighted when I break 26.4 Kbps... my phone lines suck beyond belief.
Response #14
By: The Sorcerer
Date: 4/18/99 11:41:01 PM
Spaz Sez:
=================================
Not that I don't really like it, it's just that from what I have seen amomgst many of my friends, they are letting their hatred of Wanrner cable, mar their judgement. For one thing, ADSL come is 2 flavors, lite and heavy. The lite version, is the pretty much the same as cable modem, 512 kbps. The heavy version is capable 6 Mbps, but they are
charging an arm and a leg for it. (about as much as a T-1 last time I priced them back in August). From much of what I have read, they are very prone to congestions and burst problems, due to the way the POTS are set up typically. Also too, they are very prone to line drop off, the farther you are awat from the switching station, the worse your
performance is. Price, perfomance, just not as comparable as what you get with the cable modem.
==================================
As far as pricing...the best I can tell is someone out there is really screwing people on pricing. Either that or Austin and Atlanta are just more expensive for some reason. You can get into the basic ADSL setup (between 1.5Mbps and 384 Kbps incoming and 128 Kbps outgoing) for $49/month.
I submitted my order for ADSL a few weeks ago w/ SWBell and I should hopefully have it activated and up in a couple of weeks so I'll let you know what performance is like down here. Anyway, here is the skinny on ADSL pricing in Houston.
You've got 4 pricing tiers; 2 for month-to-month customers and 2 for those who sign a year contract. They break down like this.
| Option | Term | Monthly Cost | Telco Installation | CPE* | Premises Labor |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Option 1 1.5M-384 Kbps down 128 Kbps up |
1-year contract | $39/mo. | $00 | $198 | $00 |
| Option 1 1.5M-384 Kbps down 128 Kbps up |
mo.-to-mo. | $59/mo. | $100 | $198 | $199 |
| Option 2 6M-1.5 Mbps down 348 Kbps up |
1-year contract | $129/mo. | $00 | $198 | $00 |
| Option 2 6M-1.5 Mbps down 348 Kbps up |
mo.-to-mo. | 149/mo. | $100 | $198 | $199 |
*CPE stands for Customer Premises Equipment
The stuff about line drop-off over distance is accounted for in your loop certifiaction. You have to be within 17500 ft of your Central Office switching system to qualify for ADSL. If you qualify you are guaranteed to get AT LEAST the low-end performance of 1.5 Mb or 384 k downstream and the fixed upstream rates. Otherwise you won't be able to get ADSL.
Now, on top of this you have to make sure your ISP will support ADSL. The charges for SWBell ISP service for ADSL are as follows:
| Speed Available (downstream/upstream) | 384 Kbps - 1.5 Mbps/128 Kbps |
| Unlimited Usage | yes |
| Dynamic IP Address | 1 |
| Southwestern Bell Internet Services POP E-mail Accounts | 1 |
| Southwestern Bell Internet Services Extra E-mail Boxes | 2 |
| Southwestern Bell Internet Services Extra E-mail Aliases | 2 |
| Personal Home Page Account (3 MB) | yes |
| Southwestern Bell Internet Services Extra Access Analog Modem Access Account | yes |
| Southwestern Bell Internet Services News Server Access | yes |
| Access Speeds (downstream/ upstream) |
Southwestern Bell Internet Services Monthly Price (for Basic DSL) |
|---|---|
| 384 Kbps-1.5 Mbps/128 Kbps | $10 |
| Speeds Available (downstream/upstream) | 384 Kbps - 1.5 Mbps/128 Kbps or 1.5 Mbps - 6 Mbps/384 Kbps |
| Unlimited Usage | yes |
| Static IP Addresses | 5 |
| Additional IP Address | N/A |
| Southwestern Bell Internet Services POP E-mail Accounts | 1 |
| Southwestern Bell Internet Services Extra E-mail Boxes | 4 |
| Southwestern Bell Internet Services Extra E-mail Aliases | 3 |
| Personal Home Page Account (3 MB) | yes |
| Southwestern Bell Internet Services Extra Access Analog Modem Access Account | yes |
| Southwestern Bell Internet Services News Server Access | yes |
| Custom Domain Name Registration | $100 (one-time fee) |
| Primary DNS | $100 (one-time fee) |
| Secondary DNS | yes |
| Access Speeds | Southwestern Bell Internet Services Monthly Price |
Southwestern Bell Internet Services Set-up Charge |
|---|---|---|
| 384 Kbps-1.5 Mbps/128 Kbps | $40 | $100 |
| 1.5 Mbps-6 Mbps/384 Kbps | $70 | $100 |
This certainly isn't cheaper than Cablemodem. But it isn't as costly as a T-1 and you can get a heck of alot more bandwidth. I signed up for the Premium package so I am guaranteed at least 1.5 Mbps down with 384 Kbps up.
As for quality? Like I said...I'll let you know if I have any problems with it. :)
Sorc'(Rev)
Response #15
By: The Sorcerer
Date: 4/19/99 12:07:08 AM
Spaz Sez:
===========================
And I disagree with what you said to sooz. I think it would still to her benfit to get the cable modem. She could bring alot of her stuff to her home system, and not have to worry about anyone hosting anything for her.
===========================
Like I said, all this ADSL, ISDN, Cablemodem stuff is cool. But us chipheads get off of messing around with this stuff. Setting up webservers, routers, ftp server, firewalls and dealing with people trying to sniff, spoof and hack into or stuff. While I'm sure they could if they really wanted too, I just don't get the impression that Sooz and her hubby really want to have to fuck with all this extra layer of technical shit at this point just to get a registered domain that points to their web page. Kinda's goes back to the old idea of burning down a house to get a piece of toast. Ya' know?
Sorc'(Rev)
Response #16
By: Capt. Spastic
Date: 4/19/99 8:20:24 AM
Sorc: "This certainly isn't cheaper than Cablemodem. But it isn't as costly as a T-1 and you can get a heck of alot more bandwidth. I signed up for the Premium package so I am guaranteed at least 1.5 Mbps down with 384 Kbps up. "
And paying alot more than I do. $37 a month, that's with them as ISP.
Like I said though, main reason I'm staying away from it is the info I have read speaks too much of the shotty performance of it. When I got the first info on them bringing ADSL into Texas back in August last year, I gathered a bunch of info on it it. Shit load of URL's (which if I still had my computers, I could easily pass on to you), the info that I gathered from the testers that had been involved with it, was much as I stated earlier. Hopefully, they probably have found a way around most of that. The thing I'll really be interested to see is how they are indeed going to get around the drop off problem.
Sorc: "Like I said, all this ADSL, ISDN, Cablemodem stuff is cool. But us chipheads get off of messing around with this stuff. Setting up webservers, routers, ftp server, firewalls and dealing with people trying to sniff, spoof and hack into or stuff. While I'm sure they could if they really wanted too, I just don't get the impression that Sooz and her hubby really want to have to fuck with all this extra layer of technical shit at this point just to get a registered domain that points to their web page. Kinda's goes back to the old idea of burning down a house to get a piece of toast. Ya' know?"
I agree there, I was just getting at the fact that since they have been somwhat long suffering in their dilemma now with this problem, in the long run, might be an easier solution to crack a couple of books, ask a few friends, and do it yourself. Bind your domain name to your local IP, and do it yourself.
Just like with sex, sometimes doing it yourself is the most satisfying way to go!!
Response #17
By: The Sorcerer
Date: 4/19/99 10:49:04 AM
Spaz Sez:
==========================
And paying alot more than I do. $37 a month, that's with them as ISP.
==========================
True, but for much a fatter pipe. That goes with the territory. I knew that going in. Besides, it looks like I am actually VERY close to my C.O. so my performance should be close to or at the High End.
Spaz Sez:
==========================
I gathered from the testers that had been involved with it, was much as I stated earlier. Hopefully, they probably have found a way around most of that. The thing I'll really be interested to see is how they are indeed going to get around the drop off problem.
==========================
There two ways to fix the drop-off problem. Both require costly upgrades to their outlying cabling and switching nodes. From what I hear they plan to upgrade that later because of the cost associated with it. But the RBOCs will have to do it eventually because they will need that kind of infrastructure to keep their dominance as the primary data carrier to all business and homes. The fact that the cable companies are going to compete directly with them by offering cheap telephone service over cable leaves them very little choice.
Sorc'(Rev)
Response #18
By: The Sorcerer
Date: 4/19/99 7:17:12 PM
Spaz, I forgot to ask.... What are you getting in terms of outbound speed? I know your inbound is 512k, yes? Do you still have to have a phone line for the outbound data?
Sorc'(Rev)
Response #19
By: sooz
Date: 4/20/99 12:55:20 PM
I'm very impressed with the use of tables up there. Quite pleasing to the eye.
Sorc', THANK YOU. I believe that's what I'll do... get one o' them $5 or $10/month servers, put my front page there, and leave the rest where it is. I spose I can leave my front page on my own server too, for those that are still accessing it the long way (via links scattered aroung the 'net).
Response #20
By: Ralf
Date: 4/20/99 11:43:32 PM
Decentralization: the wave of the future. Little bits and pieces scattered hither and yon, but all finding their unique ways to your browser when called.
Response #21
By: Capt. Spastic
Date: 4/21/99 2:57:11 PM
Sorc: "Spaz, I forgot to ask.... What are you getting in terms of outbound speed? I know your inbound is 512k, yes?"
Out bound averages about 384k, depending on network traffic. Typically, if I pull down from my system at home I get about 10kbps to 50kbps to 150kbps. But I think that hsa to do with our firewall, and network traffic. A friend of mine was pulling down from his sytem one night, and he also has one, and was peaking 200kbs. I know someone posted that about having to have a seperate phone line, but that's not true.
Sooz: "I'm very impressed with the use of tables up there. Quite pleasing to the eye."
What table?
Response #22
By: Gowan McGland
Date: 4/22/99 9:10:24 PM
Sooz said that and she was talking about the tables that Sorc made for the ADSL info.
Response #23
By: Ralf
Date: 4/23/99 9:52:00 AM
I thought she was referring to the fine teak furniture Rick makes on the side.
Response #24
By: Homer The Brave
Date: 4/25/99 5:27:56 AM
sooz, if I were in your position, I'd need to stretch my shoulders.
Then after I stretched my shoulders, I'd get an account with a cheap web hosting service and just move the whole site to it. Then I'd put a single page on the texas.net site which says something like 'This web site has moved, cuz we're too cool to stay in one place for too long. Our new url is www.richielrocksyerfrikkinworld.com. please bookmark the new url.' Then I'd use the space freed up on the texas.net server for storing more realaudio/mp3 songs.
Then I'd get a van and drive cross-country, picking up hitchhiking hippie chicks wherever I found them. Your mileage may vary.
Response #25
By: Gowan McGland
Date: 4/25/99 10:29:44 AM
And maybe a great dane and a guy with a goatee and you could solve mysteries and stuff.
Response #26
By: sooz
Date: 4/25/99 11:46:15 AM
Homey, you shoulda been at Eeyore's birthday party yesterday. They had the "Best old hippie" contest, and the guy that won, well... he was the founding member of Shiva's Headband, used his signing bonus with a label to start the Armadillo World Headquarters, his kids are named Spring, Summer, etc. and one is named after a type of Cannibis. He's made 50+ bumper stickers, one being "We who are about to inhale salute you." He's never had a "real" job, except for posing nude for the UT art department. And he rarely showers. I liked him.
Response #27
By: Homer The Brave
Date: 4/25/99 8:40:24 PM
Hey, cool. Sounds like my housemates.
If only I had known about Eeyore's birthday party *before* I left Texas, things might have turned out differently...